Feedback thread gm5

[_H_]

Hi,

This is the feedback thread for the level set GM5

The levels are:

01 SO
02 SHIPS
03 SO 2
04 SYMMETRY
05 LINE
06 MAZE
07 TIME
08 SO 3
09 SQUARES
10 SO 4
11 SPEED
12 IT'S A TRAP
13 TANKS
14 PHANTOMS (added with 2.2)
15 BEIJING DEMONS
16 RIVER
17 NO WAY BACK?
18 MORE TANKS
19 DIRT AND STEEL
20 TOPOS (added with 2.2)
21 DEEP BLUE
22 MOROS' CAMPAIGN
23 SIMPLE FIERY MAZE
24 SET AND RESET
25 BUILDING A BRIDGE
26 ALL THAT YELLOW
27 OH NO! MORE PUSHING
28 100 SWITCHES
29 RESTRICTIONS
30 BOUNCY BALLS
31 TOO MUCH PUSHING
32 CLASSIC MAZE
33 24
34 EVEN MORE TANKS
35 9 ROOMS
36 14 TILES
37 CLEMENTIA (removed with 2.1)
37 WATER LILIES (added with 2.1)
38 LETUS
39 TEAMWORK?
40 NEAR THE END?
41 ELEMENTARY BLOCK PUSHING
42 CLONES
43 TELEPORT CONVOLUTION (added with 2.2)
44 IN A HURRY?
45 FOO
46 BAR
47 MELINDA'S DODECAHEDRON
48 AROUND THE WORLD
49 RAILROAD CROSSING
50 BLUE SKY AND FIRE
51 THIEVISH GHOST
52 DIRTY MAZE
53 IN THE MIDDLE OF NOWHERE
54 SET IN MOTION
55 WAVE
56 IN A MINEFIELD
57 WARP (added with 2.2)
58 TOUKA (added with 2.2)
59 INTERCHANGED
60 PINK IS THE NEW GREEN
61 THE SQUARE OF 10
62 JOINT EFFORT (added with 2.0)
63 2EZ2H
64 INFINITE MOTION (added with 2.1)
65 UNRAVELING MYSTERY (added with 2.2)
66 FINAL

Bonus levels:
67 FRACTAL
68 SO MUCH (added with 2.1)

Every comment is appreciated.

[Joshua Bone]

Already sent a PM, here's my public feedback.

Had a great time playing through. Very distinctive level design, and I like the variety/exploration on levels like MAZE and SO 3, the tight sokobans, and the very non-obvious puzzle concepts in SHIPS, LINE, TANKS, and TIME for example. Replays included is a plus. Single biggest change I'd make is to add generous time limits to all of these (I usually go with about 2 or 2.5x the time it takes me to solve it). My feeling is that generally within the CC community all levels have time limits unless they are really super long and difficult, or else have lots of random blob activity. This is to give the levels maximum replay value by encouraging the optimizer crowd to spend time on your levels. Thanks for the fun gameplay experience!

Levels are rated on a 1-5 scale in 4 categories, C=how much I like the concept, D=difficulty of figuring out what to do (i.e. puzzle), E=difficulty of executing solution (i.e. action), F=how much fun I had playing it.


01 SO
Almost too easy, but hey, it’s fun.
CDEF 3113

02 SHIPS
Again, this is such a great, simple, monster-dodger. Wish it had a time limit.
CDEF 4235

03 SO 2
Good step up in difficulty from SO 1.
CDEF 3213

04 SYMMETRY
Ok. It feels pretty forgettable compared to some of these other designs though.
CDEF 2132

05 LINE
Great puzzle, so many `that-almost-works’ moments.
CDEF 5415

06 MAZE
I like the fixes from previous version, it’s a fun level.
CDEF 3224

07 TIME
Fun other than the bombs on FFs.
CDEF 4334

08 SO 3
Really nice mix of concepts, sokobans are tough but fair for their placement, I like the starting teleport mix, the ice maze, and the glider puzzle in particular.
CDEF 4334


09 SQUARES
Lots of fun, simple to play, memorable for that stream of tanks
CDEF 4224

10 SO 4
First one, really easy. Second one had me tearing out my hair, it seemed so impossible for the longest time. Nice puzzle!
CDEF 4514

11 SPEED
Felt impossible at first, had to come up with a good strategy. My solution ended up being very similar to the replay.
CDEF 2333

12 IT’S A TRAP
Nice level, feels like a mix of a few CC2 puzzles with a little added. Fun and a little bit of a challenge especially in the first room. Was the yellow door the ‘trap’? (edit: from PM, yes, it is).
CDEF 3323

13 TANKS
I really like this concept of stringing yellow tanks along in small grouped commands. However, I think this level loses style points in relying on the player to understand that one of the East moves will be ignored while the tank is in the teleport, i.e. the first time the tank moves right it moves 3 squares plus the teleport, while the second it only moves 2. I got it just fine but someone less familiar with the nuances of the game might not get it. Blue wall maze at the end? Why? It’s not bad at all, just feels mildly out of place.
CDEF 5413 (edit: changes will be released next version)

14 FINAL
Still too much sokoban for me But the fact that it works blows my mind
-not rated-

[_H_]

Thanks a lot for your feedback!

Single biggest change I'd make is to add generous time limits to all of these (I usually go with about 2 or 2.5x the time it takes me to solve it). My feeling is that generally within the CC community all levels have time limits unless they are really super long and difficult, or else have lots of random blob activity. This is to give the levels maximum replay value by encouraging the optimizer crowd to spend time on your levels.

That's probably a good idea, I added generous time limits to all the levels except the final.

13 TANKS

I really like this concept of stringing yellow tanks along in small grouped commands. However, I think this level loses style points in relying on the player to understand that one of the East moves will be ignored while the tank is in the teleport, i.e. the first time the tank moves right it moves 3 squares plus the teleport, while the second it only moves 2. I got it just fine but someone less familiar with the nuances of the game might not get it. Blue wall maze at the end? Why? It’s not bad at all, just feels mildly out of place.
CDEF 5413 (edit: changes will be released next version)

You are right in every point. Removed the gimmick. Somehow when building the level, it felt like there should be something more than just the exit after the trap, but removed the mini maze now, since I anyhow never was convinced by it.

Finished the second yellow tank level (MORE TANKS) and included it now as well.

[Pulluxx]

I played through most of your set and I thought I'd give you some feedback. You're free to take what you want to heart and discard what you feel isn't appropriate, these are my personal opinions and of course biased .

In general, I had a good time with the set. You have a talent for sokobans and cool puzzles, which naturally translates into fun experiences. Personally, I would have liked for a bit more attention being paid to the layout and concepts of the levels - I would have liked if your levels, instead of mostly being a collection of puzzles had more of a theme and that they then would not carry such generic titles. I feel you have created some great puzzles, I would like them to connect together to even greater levels than they are now. Not really a major issue though, cause I really liked the set and had a lot of fun playing it.

1 SO

Easy and short, but a good warm up.

2 SHIPS

I think the monster patterns was really cool, but I didn't think it was that fun to actually play. But I prefer puzzles to dodging monsters, so that's my bias

3 SO 2

Nice little sokoban.

04 SYMMETRY

This level felt like filler. I think you could do without it.

05 LINE

This one was great! Excellent use of the wiring system without it becoming hard to comprehend. One of the levels where the brevity really worked in favor for it. My favorite so far.

06 MAZE

I haven't actually gotten around to finishing this one.

07 TIME

Very tight time limit. Bomb-dodging areas and monster areas was a bit mean to have when it's a level you need to replay a lot of times to win. I liked the general idea but those two things made me not like the level itself.

08 SO 3

Great puzzles, great sokobans, a lot of areas I had fun with figuring out. One of the most fun levels in my opinion.

09 SQUARE

This level was ok. For me it was kinda hard to figure out all the wirings. So I mostly winged it, tried out some buttons and made it to the exit without having to think too much.

10 SO 4

I can't for the life of me solve that last sokoban. It must be possible, unless you and Joshua are in cahoots . I like the layout of the level, even though it feels like those turtles around the island are mocking my sokoban-solving shortcomings .

11 SPEED

Short, pretty good level. I didn't really have a strategy, I just ran and lured some of them into bombs.

12 IT'S A TRAP

Wow, I really liked this level! All rooms had great puzzles that really required you to think in new ways to solve, the type of puzzles you feel really accomplished when you figure out . I was stuck on the second and the last room for some time each, which is a plus.

13 TANKS

Very cool, experimental level. Had a good difficulty level, it wasn't too hard and gave me a much needed breather

14 ONE DIRECTION

As a general principle, I try to stay away from Chip's Challenge levels named after boy-bands, but I made an exception in this case . I have no idea how you made it so that you won there. Cool little puzzle level, even though levels like these always come across a little hodge-podge when you're not using all the elements on the map.

That's all the levels I got through, will get you more feedback when I complete the rest.

[_H_]

Thanks for your review and comments to the levels

The focus creating these levels was more on the puzzles then any theme but perhaps this can be improved in the future. The level titles are a real problem, I'm not really creative with them (btw good ideas are welcome), and a band stole my name (OK, probably I should have searched the web first before giving names to levels, or hear more pop songs, but the latter will probably not happen...)

04: This one might really be a little boring, but on the other hand, as long as it is not really annoying, unfun or broken, it might just adds a bit to the variety of different level types, and how bad could it be, to send some bugs to their well earned scuba diving holidays - or whatever they do in the water - after be annoying to players in other levels.

07: I'll probably change the bombs on the FFs in a way that you don't have to worry about them if you don't want to save additional time. Since you don't have to collect all the chips from the monsters, I think this area isn't too mean...

10: Since the replays (via F3 in the editor) of the levels (should at least) show all solutions, there is no room for such deception

12: The last room is strongly inspired by Joshua Bones level Construction Zone from the main cc2 level set, as I really liked the resulting checkered pattern.

14: For the sake of irony this one will be named after a song, however it took quite some time to find a nice song where google's results aren't something completely different or some other song. The new title will probably be Beijing Demons.
The idea of mechanism is again borrowed from Joshua, it's in his new level set in Redemption Level.

[Pulluxx]

The focus creating these levels was more on the puzzles then any theme but perhaps this can be improved in the future. The level titles are a real problem, I'm not really creative with them (btw good ideas are welcome), and a band stole my name (OK, probably I should have searched the web first before giving names to levels, or hear more pop songs, but the latter will probably not happen...)

Yeah, probably not a good idea to subject yourself to pop music just to get names for Chip's Challenge levels

04: This one might really be a little boring, but on the other hand, as long as it is not really annoying, unfun or broken, it might just adds a bit to the variety of different level types, and how bad could it be, to send some bugs to their well earned scuba diving holidays - or whatever they do in the water - after be annoying to players in other levels.

Yeah, I agree. It's not an offensive level, it just paled a bit in comparison to the others

[_H_]

Version 1.2.2 is now online.

The biggest changes are that several new levels were added, an intentionally annoying script is included and some non ragtime music for the final.

Hope you enjoy the new version

[Pulluxx]

Holy snarky narrator Batman! Here's the continuation of my review:

06 MAZE

This is a level in which you feel accomplished after beating it due to the grand size. I liked that there was no real cooks that experienced and patient players wouldn't do, and that the monster sections wasn't tough. Would have been annoying to fail and have to restart because of something like that.

16 NO WAY BACK?

A tricky and a little bit mean level (not enough to demoralize you though). One of my favorites actually, it took me some time to beat it, but that's the levels you end up liking, right?

17 MORE TANKS

The big budget sequel to Tanks. I didn't understand why some buttons didn't work. Didn't finish it.

18 DIRT AND STEEL

One of my favorites of the new ones. Great teamwork level, which is just the right size as to not become tedious. Not too hard, but required some 'aha!'-moments.

19 DEEP BLUE

This one seemed super mysterious at first. Is it named after the chess-playing computer (my guess) or just like, deep blue? I did pull it off however. I like the layout of the level, and the puzzle was nice to figure out.

20 TEAMWORK?

This level is really hard to grasp just by the look of it. Tried a few times but then gave up.

21 NEAR THE END?

Short and sweet.

23 FRACTAL

An ok bonus level, but could have been a bit shorter.

I still haven't beaten FINAL, but I*m expecting a gold medal in the mail once I do.

[_H_]

Thanks a lot for your feedback again!

06: The main intention here was to build a big fun to play maze (at least some kind of), with a few really easy puzzles (if you can call them this). Good to hear that it is a success in this regard. Added some bonus time now, to avoid any time problems as long as no one gets completely lost.

16: No Way Back is really a bit mean in this regard, the chip, the blue teleport and the toggle walls. There is always something where you have to carefully look ahead...

17: Hmmm... Obviously one of the cases, where knowing what to do, made me think, it's pretty clear how to find it out, but it isn't.
Now added a clue, which states:
Direct the tank X positions towards you, iff you are on the same row or column.
I hope this hint is understandable, it means at the start, you can e.g. direct the yellow tank 1 position upwards, which is 2 tiles, by pressing the column button at the top with the number 1. The number 0 means, there can't be a position change in this direction at this position. The tank always has to end up on tiles with a pink button, otherwise you are stuck, and that's true as well, if the tank is destroys by a flame thrower.
All the buttons however should work as intended, I recall testing this thoroughly. I think it's a really interesting type of puzzle, and definitely nothing I ever saw in cc before, so I hope you give this one another chance.

19: Yes, the name chosen with regards to chess (thinking where every peace will end up after some moves but the blue floor tiles made their contribution as well ^^) - normally, I've to admit, I'm not the biggest fan of chess, but after the epic match Yi vs Bruzón a week ago, I thought that there has to be an allusion to chess in there.

20: I really was unsure, when making this one, if it's either really straight forward or really tricky. Since I tended towards the latter, I indirectly marked the end positions of all three blocks, and this way I think it should be doable without spending too much time (what ever this means). But somehow glad to hear that it's not trivial as a result of this measures

23: Initially I was going to make it a E-curve with n=2, but after finishing half the level, I realized that it's way too big, and made a new one with a Hilbert curve, again with n=2. It's true, it gets a bit tedious, but otherwise you wouldn't see anything of the fractal structure. Though it's not included in the pack because it's exciting to play, but the fact that I like the look of the level

A virtual medal (some nice picture or rather a quick and dirty made ray tracing one) can be the reward B)

[_H_]

out now